different types of dog work

Discuss working your Gundog or tell us about your experiences be it sublime or ridiculous!
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westcountry
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by westcountry » Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:25 pm

CockerCanuck wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:51 pm
Naj wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:28 pm
It would be amusing, the British attitude to noise, if it weren’t taken so seriously. You’d think it was a personal slur on the good name of the owner if they have a noisy dog.

Naj
No one likes a noisy whining dog when sitting waiting for a retrieve whether that is on a peg or in a duck boat. However, I have never understood the aversion to giving tongue when actively chasing ground game or cripples. Maybe it is growing up with hounds but it seems like an asset to me in letting you know what is going on and where they are.

None of my current dogs make any noise in the field but I used to have a ESS bitch who gave voice when chasing a rabbit and occasionally on a crippled pheasant. Never any other time, I thought she was quite brilliant.
Got an ESS makes a noise occasionally on peg and often when in pursuit of a runner,he is a very good dog and I seldom leave home without him. But I had him neutered as noise is unacceptable in a spaniel,or lab for that matter.

Naj
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by Naj » Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:50 pm

That was along the lines of what I was thinking, CC. I had a cocker that gave the occasional yip when hunting and the breeder took her off me because he hunted a pack of Cockers pushing out rabbits to standing guns and liked a noisy dog because it increased their life expectancy! In a British spaniel trial dogs are put out just for giving one yip at being cast off to hunt, which seems to be a trigger point for some. It’s a bit daft because if you know your dog is prone to this you can manage the release differently and hide the fault. Some Spaniels will give a frustrated yip when pushing hard on a moving pheasant that is evading them in cover. All very embarrassing :lol: and often signs the transfer warrant of the dog in question.

Naj

CockerCanuck
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by CockerCanuck » Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:58 pm

I can understand not breeding from dogs with a tendency for noise as I suspect it is a "slippery slope" and an occasional yip today in a couple of generations could lead to dogs that never shut up. However, I have never worried much about it in my rough shooting dogs. For waterfowl I hate a noisy dog, but I also don't like them to be restless and fidget. I encourage and have always managed to get dogs which are steady, calm and quiet in this "context".

westcountry
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by westcountry » Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:08 pm

Naj wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:50 pm
That was along the lines of what I was thinking, CC. I had a cocker that gave the occasional yip when hunting and the breeder took her off me because he hunted a pack of Cockers pushing out rabbits to standing guns and liked a noisy dog because it increased their life expectancy! In a British spaniel trial dogs are put out just for giving one yip at being cast off to hunt, which seems to be a trigger point for some. It’s a bit daft because if you know your dog is prone to this you can manage the release differently and hide the fault. Some Spaniels will give a frustrated yip when pushing hard on a moving pheasant that is evading them in cover. All very embarrassing :lol: and often signs the transfer warrant of the dog in question.

Naj
You are very correct naj,the top trainers can keep that yip under bay with clever handling and then when the dog is a winner,people breed from a dog with a squeak. For rough shooting and picking up I have no problem with a squeak. But I wouldnt buy a puppy from one that squeaked.

munstyman
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by munstyman » Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:16 pm

CockerCanuck wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:51 pm
No one likes a noisy whining dog when sitting waiting for a retrieve whether that is on a peg or in a duck boat. However, I have never understood the aversion to giving tongue when actively chasing ground game or cripples. Maybe it is growing up with hounds but it seems like an asset to me in letting you know what is going on and where they are.

None of my current dogs make any noise in the field but I used to have a ESS bitch who gave voice when chasing a rabbit and occasionally on a crippled pheasant. Never any other time, I thought she was quite brilliant.
I agree CC, there is a time and a place and a little `practical' leeway may be a good thing. I'm old, so a good tune with lyrics I can listen too, but Rap or Garage I don't want to hear and apply that to my dogs ;)
I'll own up to being a right tit with the old boy, in that he was a natural totverbeller. I was set on training the bringsel report at the time and mis-read coming home to find him `singing' . I thought he was just starting to be one of those `vocal Munsters' which I wasn't going to have and read the riot act to poor sod. Only after did I see that I had left the deer dummy in the same room and put two and two together :doh: A real case of act in haste and repent at leisure, especially as he never took to the bringsel. :roll: We ended up with a unique silent report I called peak a boo, spotting a black headed dog at dusk looking out of cover is a lot more difficult than homing in on a nice Germanic opera though :think:

CockerCanuck
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by CockerCanuck » Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:38 pm

My experience is there is a lot to do with "context" in noise as well. I had a very nice male Yellow Lab years ago that when he was a pup started "singing" (sort of a soft yodel) to my wife when she was preparing his dinner. She thought it was quite funny and to my horror encouraged it despite my repeated requests not to. It was a friction point between us for a while until I realized I never heard him make a sound while training and his first year of hunting. He had a long career as a waterfowl dog and never made any noise in the field, no matter how hot the action. But he became positively operatic when my wife fed him. Interestingly when she was away and I fed the dogs he never made any noise. It was something he only shared with her.

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Gundogguy
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by Gundogguy » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:04 pm

CockerCanuck wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:38 pm
My experience is there is a lot to do with "context" in noise as well. I had a very nice male Yellow Lab years ago that when he was a pup started "singing" (sort of a soft yodel) to my wife when she was preparing his dinner. She thought it was quite funny and to my horror encouraged it despite my repeated requests not to. It was a friction point between us for a while until I realized I never heard him make a sound while training and his first year of hunting. He had a long career as a waterfowl dog and never made any noise in the field, no matter how hot the action. But he became positively operatic when my wife fed him. Interestingly when she was away and I fed the dogs he never made any noise. It was something he only shared with her.
ha ha! 45 years with the same Spaniel Lady, and i have learn to let "some" dogs lay! Happy wife happy life! Thanks for sharing CC.
"In the end We all get the dog we deserve"

Dartmoordog
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by Dartmoordog » Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:24 pm

newf wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:31 pm
trekmoor wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:22 pm



I.M.O. the most unsuitable job for an HPR is as a beaters dog, these breeds were never meant to hunt close alongside spaniels. They were also never meant for use among cover with a bird behind every second clump of bushes or every second turnip . They are meant to find the widely scattered and very sparse game in large fields or on moors and hills and woodlands.....preferably wild bred birds.

Wullie
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Be careful what you say about my wife or kids, be VERY careful what you say about my gundogs.

Rough_mut
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by Rough_mut » Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:10 am

Dartmoordog wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:24 pm
newf wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:31 pm
trekmoor wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:22 pm



I.M.O. the most unsuitable job for an HPR is as a beaters dog, these breeds were never meant to hunt close alongside spaniels. They were also never meant for use among cover with a bird behind every second clump of bushes or every second turnip . They are meant to find the widely scattered and very sparse game in large fields or on moors and hills and woodlands.....preferably wild bred birds.

Wullie
Common sense prevails. :-D
A big “here, here” 👍
I would love a pointer as my next dog, something about them really interests me! They just look like there meant to 'go'. Unfortunately the shooting I have access to just wouldn't work with them and I don't have access to enough wild game so I would imagine they would just become big spaniels that range too much!

The only only pointers I have seen on our shoot where two GWP's and to be franc they where not only useless on the shoot but a a hindrance. They also had e collars on to stop them ranging too far but one was hardened to this and still ignored the e collar. Such a shame because they where the biggest Germans I have seen and looked like they could eat a entire moorside and not feel it!

Unfortunately they only pointed dead game, wouldn't retrieve it, didn't like swimming and had no recall what so ever! 100% down to the trainer but I think sometimes it's easy to get a dog because you 'like the breed but your fighting an uphill battle to try and make it fit what you do.

One day I will one, but only when I have access to the right kind of land and shooting!

Rm

Springfield Pointers
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Re: different types of dog work

Post by Springfield Pointers » Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:19 am

Rough_mut wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:10 am
The only only pointers I have seen on our shoot where two GWP's and to be franc they where not only useless on the shoot but a a hindrance. They also had e collars on to stop them ranging too far but one was hardened to this and still ignored the e collar. Such a shame because they where the biggest Germans I have seen and looked like they could eat a entire moorside and not feel it!

Unfortunately they only pointed dead game, wouldn't retrieve it, didn't like swimming and had no recall what so ever! 100% down to the trainer but I think sometimes it's easy to get a dog because you 'like the breed but your fighting an uphill battle to try and make it fit what you do.
Well that's a little like someone buying a Porsche Spider and then finding out that it can't drive up a muddy hill, then saying Landrovers are useless and you'd never buy one.

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