any images of snipey headed cocker spaniels

[currieddog1]

Ignoring discomfort is as much a physical thing as it is a mental thing. You are right about the red herring but my question related to conformation affecting or not affecting working ability. It clearly does.

[currieddog1]

Good analogy as I ' m very aware of terriers but the performance could be the same , both eager to go to ground , but the conformation of one overcomes the other, so the result of that performance is , successful or not.

This too. Mental ability not related to conformation. The dog could be a physical cabbage conformation wise but as eager as the next to go to ground.It's performance would be none existent.

[allan450]

thanks for all the replys made for a interesting read.just to throw a spanner into the works.as iv never been to a cocker trial [will be doing a few tests this summer to get me started] if you a lightly built cocker against a stocky type surely the lightly cocker will cover ground quicker and look just a little more stylish.now im only going from watching my two as my bitch is smaller and lighter and the two dogs going the exact same thing she is easier one the eye so to speak.hope people understand what is trying to say.or is that a story for an other way.

[currieddog1]

Talk about red herrings....Allan450.

The human eye or personal preference does not come into the equation regarding conformation being either beneficial or detrimental to a dogs working ability and personal preference will decide the outcome of any test or trial you decide to enter.

[Rookie]

if you a lightly built cocker against a stocky type surely the lightly cocker will cover ground quicker and look just a little more stylish.:

Again, I think determination and motivation come into play a bit. I have what I would call a relatively stocky cocker dog and a small slightly built springer bitch who is only slightly bigger than most trial bred cockers.

The small bitch should probably please most peoples eye in the type of cover we mainly have here and especially when younger she had a bit of go about her but she isn't the bravest of dogs in heavy stuff. She loves to please and is sometimes more concerned about getting praise and attention than getting on with the job, especially if it's been a fruitless hunt. In moderate cover the stocky cocker can turn it on and will hunt for scent with enthusiasm for much longer before getting fed up. Give him a good reason to and he will tackle heavier cover reasonably well but again, age has taught him a few things. On the hill he'll hunt like a pointer given half a chance, hunting for scent. HPR folk seem to like watching him then but I don't think spaniel folk would think much of it!

Of that pair the cocker has far more "drive" and I think that helps when it comes to "style".

[Springfield Pointers]

Speed and a lighter frame does not necessarily produce a good bird dog. The yanks have found that out to their detriment and have produced some dogs with great run but little nose or hunting nous. It's a bigger picture and there is more to it than conformation alone.

[currieddog1]

as above just out of curiosity as i here it alot on this form is their any images of cockers with a snipey head.the reason also i recently bought a cocker bitch and her head isnt as blocky as the dog i have.i know a bitches head wont be as big but its just to put my mind at rest thanks people.

It is very easy to get 'off railed' on threads and my sincere appologies for wandering a touch. The "conformation doesn't affect the working ability of a dog" statement had to be tackled though.It would appear to be 'put to bed', that one.

What is it in your mind that needs putting to rest allan450?

[Judy]

At six months the pup's head hasn't finished growing it will change along with the rest of her body.

The human eye or personal preference does not come into the equation regarding conformation being either beneficial or detrimental to a dogs working ability and personal preference will decide the outcome of any test or trial you decide to enter.

Not sure what you mean here, taken as written the implication is any dog could win provided the Judge liked the look of it? Personal preference wins every time in dog shows but training / luck on the day and dog's natural ability play a bigger part in Tests and Trials, at least they should do if the Judge is judging the right end of the lead but that's a whole other can of worms.

Style is no use without all the other parts, Allan, if your dog is the better game finder and more able retriever then your bitch's perceived extra style will count for nowt. Its the whole package which counts.

[currieddog1]

At six months the pup's head hasn't finished growing it will change along with the rest of her body.

The human eye or personal preference does not come into the equation regarding conformation being either beneficial or detrimental to a dogs working ability and personal preference will decide the outcome of any test or trial you decide to enter.

Not sure what you mean here, taken as written the implication is any dog could win provided the Judge liked the look of it? Personal preference wins every time in dog shows but training / luck on the day and dog's natural ability play a bigger part in Tests and Trials, at least they should do if the Judge is judging the right end of the lead but that's a whole other can of worms.

Style is no use without all the other parts, Allan, if your dog is the better game finder and more able retriever then your bitch's perceived extra style will count for nowt. Its the whole package which counts.

The decision will ALWAYS boil down to preference. After all the luck, good fortune, bad fortune, in form trainer,in form dog,weather,terrain and all the other eqations you want to throw at the statement are taken into account-notes will be compared, notes based on personal preference, with the dogs left on show,all performed in their own ways without being eliminated, personal preference-even a combined personal preference, will always,ALWAYS, be the deciding factor.

[allan450]

thanks for all the replys again made an interesting read.thats very true judy and the dog has a serious nose especial for woodcock which he was pacifically bought for i will post a few pics of the bitch later to see about her snipy head[back to the tread] ha ha