You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, andca clear path to helping the dig gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Bang on,
Now ... can anyone think of a programme or approach that someone can follow to show the dog that the stop will mean birds to retrieve and chasing means no birds?
Springfield Pointers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:28 pm
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, andca clear path to helping the dig gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Bang on,
Now ... can anyone think of a programme or approach that someone can follow to show the dog that the stop will mean birds to retrieve and chasing means no birds?
As SP says, ‘hunting over it.’ That is the final part of the program.
I do expose my young dogs to dead birds and live clips at a very young age but do not hunt them or enter them in hunt tests or puppy stakes until they steady which is normally around 1 year old or so. I just do not want to go back and steady a dog that had been allowed to chase as it may take more pressure on the dog and I will not steady a dog at a young age.
With one of my dogs I decided to do it the UK way and did not give him clips or dead birds until I had finished all his obedience. I cannot say for sure it had any impact but he is now 2 1/2 and I feel his bird drive is lacking as is his bird work. I wonder now if he would have been a better bird dog if I had exposed him early to birds like I have my other 3 dogs (all bird crazy). Who knows
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Bang on,
Now ... can anyone think of a programme or approach that someone can follow to show the dog that the stop will mean birds to retrieve and chasing means no birds?
As SP says, ‘hunting over it.’ That is the final part of the program.
Yes but few of us in uk have that option and that is the problem. Beating is what most of us have and apart from sweeping up no reward of retrieve is available therefore the reward of a flush whilst beating is a continuation of the hunt..in my humble opinion
Muddling along in the hope that one day it starts to make sense.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Bang on,
Now ... can anyone think of a programme or approach that someone can follow to show the dog that the stop will mean birds to retrieve and chasing means no birds?
As SP says, ‘hunting over it.’ That is the final part of the program.
Yes but few of us in uk have that option and that is the problem. Beating is what most of us have and apart from sweeping up no reward of retrieve is available therefore the reward of a flush whilst beating is a continuation of the hunt..in my humble opinion
Muddling along in the hope that one day it starts to make sense.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, andca clear path to helping the dig gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Yes, it should have a reward but those may only equal or be of a lesser value. Competing rewards do not work well on their own, so we have a tool (correction) so the behavior comes out precise and reliable.
Springfield Pointers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:28 pm
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, andca clear path to helping the dig gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Yes, it should have a reward but those may only equal or be of a lesser value. Competing rewards do not work well on their own, so we have a tool (correction) so the behavior comes out precise and reliable.
Um, not sure i understand.
Muddling along in the hope that one day it starts to make sense.
How do you hunt over your dog if it doesn't stop to the flush? Are you suggesting taking the dog out and just shooting at flushed game with the dog in pursuit? So it learns that working with the gun = birds?
Because if the dog is not stopping to the flush... and you want it to ... how does taking it out and shooting over it help?
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:16 pm
How do you hunt over your dog if it doesn't stop to the flush? Are you suggesting taking the dog out and just shooting at flushed game with the dog in pursuit? So it learns that working with the gun = birds?
Because if the dog is not stopping to the flush... and you want it to ... how does taking it out and shooting over it help?
Exactly why I do not hunt over a unsteady dog
I have seen many people do this and many struggle for years to steady there dogs up after allowing a season or two of chasing.
The AKC hunt test actually allows chasing and shooting over your dog in the first two levels and do not require a dog to be steady until Master (the advanced level)
I just won't do it.
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:16 pm
How do you hunt over your dog if it doesn't stop to the flush? Are you suggesting taking the dog out and just shooting at flushed game with the dog in pursuit? So it learns that working with the gun = birds?
Because if the dog is not stopping to the flush... and you want it to ... how does taking it out and shooting over it help?
Exactly why I do not hunt over a unsteady dog
I have seen many people do this and many struggle for years to steady there dogs up after allowing a season or two of chasing.
The AKC hunt test actually allows chasing and shooting over your dog in the first two levels and do not require a dog to be steady until Master (the advanced level)
I just won't do it.
I agree,
Yet some are advocating taking the dog out and hunting over it.
All I can see happening is the dog chasing, if you get a safe shot and drop a bird, then the dog has ran in and been rewarded for that?
How does this then jump to the dog stopping and waiting on the flush?
