Dropping bird

[Naj]

It can be a tired dog but it can also be the dog feeling under pressure as it approaches you, either active or inadvertent. If a dog has managed to carry a bird 50/60/100 yards without the need to put it down then there’s no earthly reason for it to do so within a few feet of you.

Naj

[newf]

It can be a tired dog but it can also be the dog feeling under pressure as it approaches you, either active or inadvertent. If a dog has managed to carry a bird 50/60/100 yards without the need to put it down then there’s no earthly reason for it to do so within a few feet of you.

Naj

[CockerCanuck]

It can be a tired dog but it can also be the dog feeling under pressure as it approaches you, either active or inadvertent. If a dog has managed to carry a bird 50/60/100 yards without the need to put it down then there’s no earthly reason for it to do so within a few feet of you.

Naj

Possibly but I honestly doubt it with my dog. He is in his third season and now knows his job so well he is under no pressure from me. In fact if I could be critical of myself at this stage it would be that I am too lax with him and overlook minor issues I would have acted on when he was younger.

On more reflection I think this could be what is going on with him. When he was a pup he was always a very keen natural retriever. Right from the start anything I threw he would run out and get and rush back to me. However his natural behaviour was to drop it in front of me then wildly stare expectantly at my face wanting me to throw again. I never did any sort of FF with this dog, because he obviously didn't need it. I just showed him it was not going to get thrown again until he put it in my hand. I think now that I have become so relaxed with him he occasionally forgets himself and reverts to his natural tendency then catches himself and realizes he has to complete the retrieve. Honestly I have not given it much thought until Ips's post. I will pay more attention on our next few outings.

[Naj]

It can be a tired dog but it can also be the dog feeling under pressure as it approaches you, either active or inadvertent. If a dog has managed to carry a bird 50/60/100 yards without the need to put it down then there’s no earthly reason for it to do so within a few feet of you.

Naj

Possibly but I honestly doubt it with my dog. He is in his third season and now knows his job so well he is under no pressure from me. In fact if I could be critical of myself at this stage it would be that I am too lax with him and overlook minor issues I would have acted on when he was younger.

On more reflection I think this could be what is going on with him. When he was a pup he was always a very keen natural retriever. Right from the start anything I threw he would run out and get and rush back to me. However his natural behaviour was to drop it in front of me then wildly stare expectantly at my face wanting me to throw again. I never did any sort of FF with this dog, because he obviously didn't need it. I just showed him it was not going to get thrown again until he put it in my hand. I think now that I have become so relaxed with him he occasionally forgets himself and reverts to his natural tendency then catches himself and realizes he has to complete the retrieve. Honestly I have not given it much thought until Ips's post. I will pay more attention on our next few outings.

Upon reflection, it’s probably quite natural for pups to drop stuff at your feet or within a yard or so of you. After all, they have a natural inclination to carry stuff but the rest is down to training and consequently the delivery to hand is something we spend a lot of time training and maintaining. When you look at videos of handlers who are more interested in hunting than fine training, especially with breeds like the pointers and setters that weren’t originally bred to retrieve, it’s pretty typical for dogs to retrieve stuff but drop it at the handler’s feet.

Naj

[crackerd]

All viable positing in this thread, no wrong answers or backbiting on yours or mine being more im/plausible.

But...I got a little chiding at the weekend by a mentor and benefactor (of my 9-month-old FT prospect). Said yearling has developed a tendency the last few training outings to spit the bird after she's lined herself up to be sent for the next retrieve in a multiple or even a "singles" (one mark at a time) situation. My "mentafactor" chivvied that "she's not completely force-fetched" because of the unauthorized spitting. I begged to differ, but only to myself, giving my mentafactor a little bromide that I was "working on it." The actual fact from my vantage is that the birds we have used repeatedly two, sometimes three times a week for the last couple months have gotten rather "unwholesome" as cold game goes. The pup is bringing the desiccated and rank poultry in on the fly and lining up well with them in her gob, but really can't wait to get rid of them (permanently if she could bring herself to say it). Bottom line is, I'm not at all concerned about the thoroughness of her force fetch - a few weeks ago I brought a power-line zapped c*rm*r@nt to training and she was picture perfect in toting and delivering the big fish duck throughout the session. My only contribution to Our Ian would be this: the side-sit delivery flourish that ain't a flourish for us but a necessity is also a good "governor" and guiding focus for getting a gundog into position to hand off the bird before going again on its merry way.

It can be a tired dog but it can also be the dog feeling under pressure as it approaches you, either active or inadvertent. If a dog has managed to carry a bird 50/60/100 yards without the need to put it down then there’s no earthly reason for it to do so within a few feet of you.

Naj

Possibly but I honestly doubt it with my dog. He is in his third season and now knows his job so well he is under no pressure from me. In fact if I could be critical of myself at this stage it would be that I am too lax with him and overlook minor issues I would have acted on when he was younger.

On more reflection I think this could be what is going on with him. When he was a pup he was always a very keen natural retriever. Right from the start anything I threw he would run out and get and rush back to me. However his natural behaviour was to drop it in front of me then wildly stare expectantly at my face wanting me to throw again. I never did any sort of FF with this dog, because he obviously didn't need it. I just showed him it was not going to get thrown again until he put it in my hand. I think now that I have become so relaxed with him he occasionally forgets himself and reverts to his natural tendency then catches himself and realizes he has to complete the retrieve. Honestly I have not given it much thought until Ips's post. I will pay more attention on our next few outings.

[ips]

CC
Exactly same for me in fact she still sometimes drops a ball at my feet with "that look of throw it again dad" like you i never have picked it up but she still does it. I cannot pin point the exact time that she started with this putting bird down at 3 or 5 yds, i stress it is not a drop or a spit and she does not ever have the bird out of her gob she seems to be merely getting a better grip however i am not convinced that this is all it is or if there is an under lying reason for the behaviour . I dont recall her doing it óften if at all with pigeon, partridge occasionally maybe, and pheasant quite often especially with not very dead uns

[chrokeva]

I tend to look differently at this...
Although I do believe a young dog can do this from being tired or just learning how to carry a bird correctly I believe a trained older dog that does this is being possesive. I have seen it become a ugly habit with my own dogs at times and now will give a stern "fetch it up" command when they stop to mess with a bird. This seems to be enough to get the dog back on track with the delivery.
Also normally you won't see this on a dummy or even a dead bird as much as a live or somewhat live bird which I believe is due to the higher value of a live bird i.e. dog is more possesive of live bird.

[ips]

I tend to look differently at this...
Although I do believe a young dog can do this from being tired or just learning how to carry a bird correctly I believe a trained older dog that does this is being possesive. I have seen it become a ugly habit with my own dogs at times and now will give a stern "fetch it up" command when they stop to mess with a bird. This seems to be enough to get the dog back on track with the delivery.
Also normally you won't see this on a dummy or even a dead bird as much as a live or somewhat live bird which I believe is due to the higher value of a live bird i.e. dog is more possesive of live bird.

Um, i think this "could" be a valid explanation

[ips]

Ok, never having been one to be bothered about folk seeing my attempts at gundog training or working here goes, a vid from last week a prime example. For the record gun is empty and brokén when i lay it down to take the retrieve. She had done same thing half hr earlier hence my vocal attempt to get her to "fetch it in" and arms spread as encouragament. I have no issues with receiving any constructive observation and or critique.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=amkk26Xfmp4

[chrokeva]

Can't really see what she is doing from the time you sent her till the time she brought the bird up to you but it sure seemed like a long time for a short retrieve? Maybe the bird was running? Or was she messing with it on the pick up? Anyway cant comment on that. It is also hard to tell if she is simply repositioning the bird or messing with the bird because she would rather not give it up but if she does it often and/or it gets worse then I would assume the latter.