It's all about the training!

[Kibble]

Hi ips, Near Loughrigg. , but not a shoot, just a few stray pheasants.

Thanks CC, little dog is being really good and walking her is suddenly a pleasure. I am not sure if all this freedom is spoiling her for beating, but just enjoying it with lovely weather.

[Judy]

Evening kibble
We were in the lakes (again ) week before last, had a very wet and wild walk around Kent mere and also lake grassmere. It is surprising how many shoots there are even in the heart of the tourist hotspots
Were abouts was your gamey ground out of interest

I went to the Lakes, once. It rained all week apart from the Saturday we arrived and the Saturday we left. We had a super cottage overlooking Windermere, there was only one problem - a constant stream of Pheasants in the garden, we each had a dog - Maggie, my Cocker and Brenda her Flatcoat, Megan. Opening the door was interesting, usually a stuttering M.M.M.M. as I tried to work out which dog I was shouting at. A couple of days into the week Bren took the mutts for a walk in the woods surrounding the cottage, she came back laughing her head off having found a release pen, not too far from our cottage. No wonder the place was crawling with Pheasies.

[ips]

Hi ips, Near Loughrigg. , but not a shoot, just a few stray pheasants.

Thanks CC, little dog is being really good and walking her is suddenly a pleasure. I am not sure if all this freedom is spoiling her for beating, but just enjoying it with lovely weather.

Um, I know it fairly well. In fact I know all of the lakes very well as I have camped and caravaned there all my life, oh and had boats (3 of em) on lake Windermere for many years....I suspect that those birds have wandered there are various shoots in that area.

[ips]

Evening kibble
We were in the lakes (again ) week before last, had a very wet and wild walk around Kent mere and also lake grassmere. It is surprising how many shoots there are even in the heart of the tourist hotspots
Were abouts was your gamey ground out of interest

I went to the Lakes, once. It rained all week apart from the Saturday we arrived and the Saturday we left. We had a super cottage overlooking Windermere, there was only one problem - a constant stream of Pheasants in the garden, we each had a dog - Maggie, my Cocker and Brenda her Flatcoat, Megan. Opening the door was interesting, usually a stuttering M.M.M.M. as I tried to work out which dog I was shouting at. A couple of days into the week Bren took the mutts for a walk in the woods surrounding the cottage, she came back laughing her head off having found a release pen, not too far from our cottage. No wonder the place was crawling with Pheasies.

Yep rain is thing in the lakes.....the saying goes if you look out of the window and it's not raining it's about to......end of weather report

[Kibble]

Mia stayed peacefully close(ish) on the Lake District fells. There was no game. At least she didn't find any. I mostly stuck to fell sides which were fairly busy, so I guess that helped. It was pleasantly better than last year, when I couldn't really trust her on these paths.

It's different now we are home and the moors have game. The moor I take her to isn't stocked, but there is still plenty of game for Mia to find.

The track up to the moor is long and I keep her on a double length lead on this track. Even so, last time we went, she flushed a few pheasants from the verges before we even got to the open moor. Next time I am going to stop on this track everytime a bird goes up, wait for her to sit and reward for looking at me. I think this was the forum advice I had for pigeons on the lane near my house. She isn't so enthused by pigeons now.

On the few occasions that Mia has set up grouse, she has been very close to me and the grouse have gone up right off her nose. I like watching them. They are such impressive and noisy birds.

It seems to be different with pheasants. I know she can scent them in the air and I have seen her follow a ground trail for a long way and set up a bird or two. She must be able to tell if it is a fresh trail. This means she can be further away than she should be, if she is going beating. I can't stop or turn her when she is on a scent trail, but I am working on stop and turn in less challenging contexts and it is a lot better than it was. I still think stop looks cool.

Even on the moor, Mia always checks where I am. I am confident she won't run off, the sheep are mostly away, and the farmer is friendly.
I have mostly got what I want from Mia, but it would still be nice to be able to work her.

[Kibble]

Today I took Mia (dog) through a bit of rough woodland at the edge of a field. She was hunting quite close, but then whizzed off into some bushes (ignored a turn whistle) and flushed a pheasant. I could see it fly. I didn't blow stop because I couldn't see Mia. She came back quite quickly. However, if I aspire to take her beating I don't think she should deviate from a prescribed 'beat'. Her ability to know there was a pheasant in the bushes seems like a disadvantage. Is it different if there is a line of dogs?

[ips]

From my experience I wouldn't worry too much about her pulling out to flush birds (after all that's what you want her to do) as long as she recalls to you once they have flushed

[ips]

From my experience of beating the reality is far removed from what you think and from what you have trained for. They will pull out and they will go self employed from time to time, you won't stop it you just have to work with it. .. ..I will get my coat

[Kibble]

Thanks ips.
Mia coming back quite quickly, after flushing a game bird, is improved behaviour. Once she was back, she was willing to engage in training games in the field, which was pleasing. In this bit of wood she might find one or two birds each time.
However, if I take her on the moors at this time of year, she will pull out further and find more birds. She always knows where I am, but I don't have control and she only comes back in her own time. I have given up the moors for now, which is a shame, because it would be a nice walk.

[Nickheref]

Today I took Mia (dog) through a bit of rough woodland at the edge of a field. She was hunting quite close, but then whizzed off into some bushes (ignored a turn whistle) and flushed a pheasant. I could see it fly. I didn't blow stop because I couldn't see Mia. She came back quite quickly. However, if I aspire to take her beating I don't think she should deviate from a prescribed 'beat'. Her ability to know there was a pheasant in the bushes seems like a disadvantage. Is it different if there is a line of dogs?

How much further out had Mia gone?

If you have read IP's thread you will have seen his nerves on getting ready for his first day expecting his to be the worst dog out , he was told it wouldn't be!

You highlight something that I have thought about for some time, dogs who hunt a very tight pattern without any deviation, other than doing the same bit of ground 3 or 4 times because at the pace they are running they have to do the same bit of ground a few times or move forward faster than the handler or hunt wider ie when hunting a very tight beat they almost have to mark time and have either been taught to ignore their nose (or not trust it) or didn't have one in the first place otherwise why go over the same bit of ground 3 times. Neither of which is much good and seems to have forgotten why we use dogs to hunt game. You won't see a pointer, setter or hpr do the same bit of ground over and over again.

Last week I was hunting my young dog and three times (in the space of an hour) he pulled rather wider on his hunting beat than his usual range, in every case it was because he had located a bird. Two he flushed across me and one started to come across but turned forward when it saw me. I killed the two who flew across me and a better shot than me would have killed the bird that flew forward.
When he first pulled out wider I could see him but wasn't sure what was going on and so was stressing a bit and thinking of turning him but wanted to know why he had suddenly chosen to go wider so just watched, by the third time I knew that he knew what he was doing and wasn't going rogue! We both learnt a lot about each other that morning! BUT I am not sure I would be prepared to give his sister such leeway at the moment as she still sees her job as solely finding game and isn't so bothered about it being shot.