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Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:21 pm
by Judy
To use an analogy mentioned above train a dog in the shallow end then, when it is mentally mature enough you can chuck it in the deep end knowing full well it can swim. I know that works and some dogs are mentally mature enough to simply generalise from one to t'other at 10 months, some at three years, at least thats been my experience over the past 30 years or so. The Cockers, ironically, maturing earlier than any of the Flatcoats ever did. Apart from one Cocker who might actually cope with a day on the game now she's 4.5, exception proves the rule.
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:28 pm
by ips
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
Um, trouble is on a beating line it actually is possible for dog to catch a bird, birds are regularly pegged against chicken wire fencing, pricked birds can also be pegged, my one had a pricked bird out of a game crop today after she chased it down a field for 100 yds
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:29 pm
by ips
Nickheref wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:17 am
Springcopse spaniels wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:46 am
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
We allow all our young dogs to chase, they soon learn.
After Lloyd had gone the other day I took one of the pups in to the wood. Where Lloyds first flush was there where 5 cock birds..plenty of scent and action
I don't allow mine to, it is just that I could not stop them even if I wanted to
Lol
Me neither, not if its pricked anyway
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:33 pm
by Springfield Pointers
ips wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:28 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
Um, trouble is on a beating line it actually is possible for dog to catch a bird, birds are regularly pegged against chicken wire fencing, pricked birds can also be pegged, my one had a pricked bird out of a game crop today after she chased it down a field for 100 yds
In fairness though. Beating is not hunting, it is immensely different. Different things are required from the dog, and therefore the type of dog required should be different. I would still introduce the dog as early as possible.
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:09 pm
by Lloyd90
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:10 pm
by ips
Springfield Pointers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:33 pm
ips wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:28 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
Um, trouble is on a beating line it actually is possible for dog to catch a bird, birds are regularly pegged against chicken wire fencing, pricked birds can also be pegged, my one had a pricked bird out of a game crop today after she chased it down a field for 100 yds
In fairness though. Beating is not hunting, it is immensely different. Different things are required from the dog, and therefore the type of dog required should be different. I would still introduce the dog as early as possible.
Very true Sir
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:13 pm
by ips
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:09 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
From my limited experience you have to train the flush to be a command in itself to stop or in my case to break away from the flush in order to get a reward of another hunt, if that makes sense
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:28 pm
by Springfield Pointers
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:09 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, and a clear path to helping the dog gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:34 pm
by ips
Springfield Pointers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:28 pm
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:09 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, andca clear path to helping the dig gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
I agree, the dog needs an alternate reward than the chase
Re: Young dogs in the field
Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:53 pm
by Lloyd90
Springfield Pointers wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:28 pm
Lloyd90 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:09 pm
Cass wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:49 pm
Once a dog knows it can't catch a bird it's not overly hard to install brakes. You can always add brakes after.... the same cannot be said for the gas pedal.
You say that, yet the internet is absolutely full of people complaining that they cannot get their dog to stop chasing game, even when it does not catch anything, it continues to chase on every flush.
Some input is needed from the human. Anticipation is a key to unlocking the puzzle, the other is building a partnership - shooting over your dog is a great way, and a clear path to helping the dog gain some clarity and focus - birds train bird dogs *cough..
A habitual chaser, is totally unaware of the partnership, and will never be, if it continues to self-hunt. The chase in itself is a reward, just leaving a dog to chase in the hope (or belief) that it will miraculously stop with no outside influence, is hoping against hope - the situation requires some management and understanding.
Now then,that is very different from the perspective often put forward, often its noted "the dog will learn it can't catch the birds and stop chasing" ... and then newbies are sat here itching their heads wondering why they can't get their dog to stop chasing every bloody thing.
