Gundog Training Forum

there is a new law on land, that taxes have to be paid on the sporting rates on land.

so land owners will be charged tax on the sporting rates of their ground, this in turn will no doubt have to move onto to the smaller shoot who will have to cover this, another cost - and maybe this is where you are hearing this from wullie ? believe it comes in April this year.

Off hand I can think of four shoots locally that have gone under in the past few years, all small fun farmer's shoots. Not good.

scot-ish wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:12 am there is a new law on land, that taxes have to be paid on the sporting rates on land.

so land owners will be charged tax on the sporting rates of their ground, this in turn will no doubt have to move onto to the smaller shoot who will have to cover this, another cost - and maybe this is where you are hearing this from wullie ? believe it comes in April this year.

Yes this sounds like what I heard. The man who told me of this is a "head picker-up" but he is also a member of a small syndicate shoot , a walk 1 ,shoot one, syndicate which he thinks could also be affected.

Wullie

But unless I have misunderstood the concept of rates they are charged whether or not the property is being used for the purpose, if it is available for use it is chargeable, so they will still be levied even if there is no shoot, it will not benefit the landowner to stop the shooting/stalking/fishing as they will be paying the rates regardless which may have some interesting and unintended consequences. However I am not an expert on Scottish Rating Law so someone may know more than me!

The rateable value is:
“The net annual value of any lands and heritages, shall be the rent at which the lands and heritages might reasonably be expected to let from year to year if no grassum or consideration other than the rent were payable in respect of the lease and if the tenant undertook to pay all rates and to bear the cost of the repairs and insurance and the other expenses, if any, necessary to maintain the lands and heritages in a state to command that rent.”

"Might reasonably be expected" not "is let" , so I don't think not using the sporting rights would get you off the hook, but I suspect any new sporting leases will make the tenant responsible for the rates, I think much will depend if deer stalking gets classed as vermin control but I believe that question is being ducked at the moment. I will be available to help control those pesky annoying grouse

Naj wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:04 pm ... and what's it got to do with the future of working gundogs?

trekmoor wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:29 pm No shoot - no gundogs.

Judy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:47 pm There's no arguing with that!

So let's take the argument "Back to the Future" of working gundogs. Some good insights on this thread, which has a parallel universe number, albeit restricted to Labrador retrievers, on a 'Merican retrieving forum, at least in the "form follows function" department: http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums ... -breedings And yes, I'm right there with the uselessness-afield-of-show-dogs brigade, especially as applies to Labs or confirmation cockers, though theoretically anything on four legs can flush - and attempt to retrieve - game. The future of working gundogs is augured by best leaving those specimens to their appointed "rounds. "

MG

Just read some of the American forum thread you posted MG. It does sound much like the same argument ! I watched working labs change in type during the late seventies and into the 80's . The change took place mainly among the field trailers who also took part in numerous tests. Faster dogs more often won in tests so type changed to get "fast." I am pleased to say that in more recent years the trend towards whippety labs has been reduced a good bit. The pendulum swung back again .

I find it worrying that people with "scurry kings and queens" can win a car with their dogs .....if the dogs can fly like sh*t off a stick . I worry that too many of those dogs would be of little use in a trial or at a shoot.....but they still get into the working labs breeding pool.

Wullie

I don't think you can blame triallers and trials for all that is wrong with modern gundogs.
Trialling has surely only become more popular as owning a gun and finding shooting has become more difficult ?
I think the biggest threat in the future to working gundogs is a lack of young people getting into shooting and needing a gundog.
Look at the average of guns ,beaters and picker uppers . There isn't many youngsters .
Airgun licensing North of the border is just another obstacle to youngsters starting shooting and getting into gundogs.

I don't recall seeing many youngsters 30 years ago either.

Oi, I was a youngster then!