reflections and redirections

Chat about anything off-topic
Post Reply
trekmoor
Member
Posts: 16074
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:38 am
Dogs: Too many and not enough !
Location: Central Scotland

reflections and redirections

Post by trekmoor »

The title refers to my redirections in life and not to a dogs. I don't know why but I always knew I wanted a gundog , I had read no books on the subject and hadn't even seen a gundog of any kind out working. I had a lot of shooting at 18 years old over 4 different farms . One farmer told me to shoot anything but his sheep and coos which was nice because his farm bordered onto a large shooting estates pheasant drives ! :lol: The other farms allowed me to shoot anything but their pheasants and partridges. I shot pigeons ,ducks and geese by the hundreds and had quite a bit of rabbit and hare shooting too. What I didn't have was a gundog.

My ignorance was so complete on the subject of gundogs that I went out and bought a show bred springer puppy. Training him was quite an experience since I didn't know what to do and had nobody to tell me. I began to buy the Shooting Times and scanned it's pages feverishly for any hints on gundog training. Peter Moxon was the gundog bloke for the Times back in the sixties and he became my "hero" quickly followed by Keith Erlandson . That pair didn't get on too well in print and I loved reading as they battled it out on the letters page.

An awful lot of their writings flew right over the top of my head ..... I didn't have a clue what they were arguing about ! By now I was beginning to realise my springer pup was somewhat lacking in natural ability. The things blokes like Moxon and Erlandson expected to be bred into a pup were having to be trained into my pup. I taught him to retrieve first and then to hunt ....in that dog's case the word "hunt" applies only very loosely ! He just didn't have it in him to hunt well. His retrieving was limited to what I knew so all he did was a basic run-in and pick it up and bring it back retrieve. He was actually quite good at doing that and he did it very well on game. He was a large, very strong dog and since I took him shooting a lot his size and strength was not due to him being fat and yet he weighed 55 lbs. at just 9-10 months old.
I tied him to my leg one evening while out shooting ducks on a very wet and muddy foreshore. I fired at a duck and off he went taking me with him. He towed me for a couple of yards through a few inches of water and an even greater depth of mud. That was when I first began to think maybe some degree of steadiness might be a good idea. I sold him to another rough shooter who thought he was O.K. for a tenner and "moved on."

A work bred lab pup was my next attempt at gundog training. He would not retrieve any kind of dummy and showed no interest in retrieving until he found a stinking, rotten , maggot covered seagull carcase one day during a walk and brought me that .......as pups will. I praised the hell out of him for that "retrieve" and took the wings home with me to attach to a dummy. He very quickly became a good retriever of anything , even glass milk bottles !

I began to take him shooting at about 5 months old. He was pretty good at heelwork and he was pretty good when sitting in a duck, goose or pigeon hide too....but back then my definition of "pretty good" was that he did not run - in unless I had actually hit what I had fired at ! :lol: He was truly outstanding as a duck shooters dog. He'd sit quietly beside me in the darkness as I looked for ducks passing by backlit by the town lights of Forfar. I'd shoot and often not know if I'd hit a duck or not .....but he knew. If he remained sitting , I'd missed. If he ran-in , I'd hit a duck. That dog used to take off into the darkness with two fields and a long strip of woods to cover in his search for shot ducks that had planed on. It was very rare for him to return without the duck.

Such was the depths of my ignorance that back then I did not know just how good a gamefinder that dog was. I thought all gundogs could have done the same. I actually got impatient and annoyed when his search took a bit of time. I wanted to shoot other ducks but knew that without him being there beside me the duck I shot might never be found.
.............................

To be continued later , I've got to go out for a while.
Wullie
If at first you don't succeed .....find out if there is a booby prize !
-----------------------------------------------------
Don't do what doesn't work - do what does.
.
pontbeck
Member
Posts: 1985
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:54 pm
Location: northumberland

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by pontbeck »

So have I Wullie and I'll look forward to reading further when I return
User avatar
andrew_94
Member
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:14 am
Dogs: Jake
Location: South Wales

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by andrew_94 »

Could this be the start of another Charlie's Chatter ?
Cave canem, te necet lingendo - Beware of the dog, he may lick you to death
Bryn
Member
Posts: 1501
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:47 pm
Dogs: Bryn (ESS)
Location: Dumfriesshire

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by Bryn »

Look forward to reading more of your reflections Wullie
Callthatagundog
Member
Posts: 578
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 6:45 am
Dogs: Labs, ESS, JRT's & WCS
Location: South Devon

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by Callthatagundog »

Hurry back - I want to read more! :-D

Sarah xx
'To err is human, to forgive canine' - with apologies to Alexander Pope
User avatar
Merlin
Member
Posts: 526
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:46 pm
Dogs: Lexie
Location: Cheshire

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by Merlin »

About time you started a thread like this, looking forward to your next installment !!!

:clap:
Image
trekmoor
Member
Posts: 16074
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:38 am
Dogs: Too many and not enough !
Location: Central Scotland

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by trekmoor »

:lol: I didn't start this with the idea of contributing another book to a library but it is heading that way ! :lol: What prompted me to begin this thread was the young man I went out with last Saturday. He seemed so very "green" to me that I made a little comparison back to when I first started with gundogs and decided he wasn't nearly as green as I had been. His family had a bit of countryside know-how and experience , mine's had none at all . I grew up in a top flat house in a central Edinburgh tenement miles away from any real countryside. The closest I came to seeing lots of "animals" was when the Heart of Midlothian football club that I lived right next to had a football match on.

Back then , drink could be taken into football matches and a good number of the fans seemed to like to pee and even defecate inside my tenement. That caused a few fights between us tenement dwellers and the fans caught in the act. Anyway the young man I took out with Libby may be a bit of a newbie to gundogs but I was far worse.

I think the turning point in my "gundog career " came when a young man of about my own age asked me to go to a gundog test to throw dead pigeons as retrieves (I don't think any company made dummies back then ?) I had still not seen a gundog other than my own out working and that test really opened my eyes to what was possible. (I think I was 18-19 years old.) I got a lift to the test in someone's car , it was years later before I owned a car, and was given instructions as to where, when and how to throw the pigeons.

To begin with I think I threw marked retrieves and was very puzzled as to why some of the handlers blew their whistles and waved their arms about...... Yes I was that green ! :lol: Then I was asked to put out blind retrieves , I kept my mouth shut but I can remember thinking I'd still be there as darkness descended if I had to wait for all those dogs to hunt all over the landscape to try to find the pigeons. I think it took a dog or two before it finally dawned on me that dogs could be stopped to whistle and then sent in a direction contrary to the one the dogs wanted to go in ! It was a "Eureka" moment in my life. There was a purpose to whistles and to arm waving after all.

That evening my head was buzzing with my new knowledge of what was possible. The odd book I'd read or the magazine articles I'd read had failed to get through into my brain cell but that very first practical demo of "real" gundog work had caused dawn to break in my head. My poor hard working Labrador got a bit of re-training following that gundog test that he hadn't even been to.

I never managed to train him not to run in but he took to stop whistles while searching for shot game fairly well and he took to arm signals very quickly. He already did his own form of "asking" for an arm signal. I used to shoot from behind a dry-stane dyke at woodpigeons flying over a field of standing crops on the other side of the dyke. The lab taught himself to jump high into the air over the tops of the crops in order to get his bearings since he never got to see the pigeons fall from our side of the dyke.
I had made use of that jump he did to wave an arm in the rough direction of the fallen pigeon and he did the rest.
That had been the full extent of my training him for blinds up until I went to that test.
......................

To be continued when my typing finger recovers.
Wullie
If at first you don't succeed .....find out if there is a booby prize !
-----------------------------------------------------
Don't do what doesn't work - do what does.
.
User avatar
Alice
Member
Posts: 2748
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:45 pm
Dogs: Spaniels
Location: Sunny South Wilts

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by Alice »

LOVE this thread- I really enjoy reading your reflections Wullie, looking forward to the next instalment!

I bet there are loads and loads more people than we 'enlighted' ones think who use gundogs in exactly the same way as you used to (actually, my other half pretty much does, his old dog has never been taught the stop whistle and is a phenomenal gamefinder, much like your lab, I think Nick just takes for granted that dogs just do it cos his does!), and are happy as larry- I kind of envy them!

ps- was the show-bred springer the one that yapped when on a bird in cover and the guy who bought him liked it?
cheers,
Alice.

A spaniel is a vehicle for a nose
User avatar
jeffD
Member
Posts: 488
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:11 am
Dogs: Teal
Location: Sunny Dawlish

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by jeffD »

Oh this brings back so many memories of my first dogs, my only training help was Peter Moxon book from the library van that used to come around. Trouble is unlike Whullie my dogs never got much better over the years :-D

Really enjoying reading these posts, hope it does develop into another Charlies Chatter.
Jeff
crackerd
Member
Posts: 1895
Joined: Mon May 14, 2012 4:20 pm

Re: reflections and redirections

Post by crackerd »

trekmoor wrote: His family had a bit of countryside know-how and experience , mine's had none at all . I grew up in a top flat house in a central Edinburgh tenement miles away from any real countryside. The closest I came to seeing lots of "animals" was when the Heart of Midlothian football club that I lived right next to had a football match on.
Bill, what was the "in the bag limit" on Jambo Tarts back then? :lol:

Carry on, please - relishing the narrative.

MG
Post Reply