Springer Advice

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Hi all,

I have a 15 month old springer bitch, in fairness I was a little slow getting into training her from a pup until I got into all of this. At the moment she recalls mostly ok, heeling is average (although this is only recent), she's very very eager to retrieve but steadyness isn't a strongpoint. I find at home or in the garden she does things perfect, walking on the street she's average and anywhere like a park where theres a distraction it's a bit of a struggle.

I thought I was doing ok until today, I went for a walk / shoot on a friends farm land with dog mostly on the lead. The few shots I got off she nearly pulled my friends arm off raring to go and pick something up (This may be down to me being a big kid and buying a dummy launcher for her - I think to her bang = run to pick up).

Later on the day she was off the lead and flushed a rabbit, then proceeded to dart after it a good 100 yard or so. No recall worked, verbal or whistle.

I'm sure I've made mistakes and got her into bad habbits which I'm trying to break - A lot of the info I read makes reference to taking any privilage from the dog, no treats, no toys no freedom etc. Is this necessary or a bit extreme (I ask as she's a pet aswell I don't want to be 'too' harsh with her).

Where should / could I be with a dog of this age? Am I expecting too much from her? Any opinions / advice welcome.

Thanks

[Lloyd90]

If you haven't trained her to heel, be steady to balls and dummy's and to listen to your commands when out walking and training , why are you taking her out and shooting rabbits over her ? Would you send a child of yours to university before they completed primary school ? Think of it like this mate!

You don't need to be harsh with her, take away toys and treats and freedom, You'll just end up with a basket case dog. Take her out, practice healing, sitting and staying with you walking around. Then sitting at a distance and being steady to a thrown ball. If she moves you gota dash and get to the ball before her and drag her back and place her back. DO NOT HIT HER , but I have given a scruffing for this and it has worked. Also work on quartering in area's with no or minimal scent. You don't want to be taking her onto game until she is trained mate!

If you do it step by step, slowly build up and work on it then you will have a nice dog. I have a dog similar age and did nothing with her, she had also had a few chases and it just meant she was very hot. Now you've let her onto game she will be very hot on scent and you will have to be ontop of her. Hammer in the baics, you cant go to step 5 until you got the first 4 done mate, there's no rush!

Best of luck, Lloyd.

[sandwillow]

You say in your original post

At the moment she recalls mostly ok, heeling is average (although this is only recent), she's very very eager to retrieve but steadyness isn't a strongpoint. I find at home or in the garden she does things perfect, walking on the street she's average and anywhere like a park where theres a distraction it's a bit of a struggle.

The advice from Lloyd is right. By your own admission you haven't trained her fully on recall or steadyness so it was a BIG mistake to take her out shooting and what happened is no surprise at all. Now she has had a find and a chase you have added rocket fuel to her tank and she will be even keener to ignore you and do her own thing . The answer is very simple and, I think, is contained in all the books, articles and videos about gundog training - get the basics right (ie train her - and that means doing it right 100% of the time wherever you are).

If she almost pulled your arm off when there was a shot you have also, inadvertantly, taught her that a bang means a retrieve and that too has contributed to her unsteadyness and made the chase even more likely. I too suggest that you go right back to basics and once you have got them instilled you can teach her that a shot means:- mark any potential retrieve, drop and await further commands. When giving her retrieving training involving a shot (and it sounds like she has already had too much of that at the expense of the sit and recall) pick up most of the retrieves yourself. You want her to associate any retrieves she is allowed as a reward for doing the mark, sit and wait bit not just the result of a bang.

It's not about taking away things from her or being nasty, its about training her and being the leader of the pack - get that right and she will love and respect you all the more . You might want to seek some help from a gundog club or professional trainer but really it's not difficult. Also it's not a race so, as already advised, go back to the beginning and get those basics 100% - you will be glad you did for the rest of her days - good luck to you.

[Ad28]

Hi chaps, advice much appreciated. A little frustrated with myself to be honest, my own inexperience / impatience doesn't help.

I guess when they start to do little things right you assume they can suddenly do the lot.

I've also had some advice from the vet when she was having her last jab, that around this age they go through a 'stage' of nothing sinking in, being very disobedient and to stop training. Is there anything in this or a load of nonsense?

[trekmoor]

Not all vets are good dog trainers ! Don't make the mistake of confusing medical know-how with dog training know-how.

I agree with the other replies. The "fault" is yours and not the dogs. If she hadn't behaved as she did when taken, unprepared by training to a shoot, I would have doubted if she had much in the way of working instincts. She obviously does have working instincts , pretty strong ones, make them work for you by settling down to training her.

Wullie

[arwesa]

I've also had some advice from the vet when she was having her last jab, that around this age they go through a 'stage' of nothing sinking in, being very disobedient and to stop training. Is there anything in this or a load of nonsense?

If this were true my hormonal teenage son would have to stop going to school untill he matured......perhaps its just anexcuse for someone not adapting their training to suit the problems.

[Gignesthai]

I have a 14month dog and an almost 17month bitch and i havent really noticed that nothing is sinking in, they also havent changed in how well they listen, I think around the 6-12 month stage at some point they may start an adolescent phase where people say recall can be an issue etc, and we did notice that bang on 6 months old our dogs recall was a little random, never would run off but wasnt coming close enough back either till the real crunch of going home. But at this stage we started to use a long line and then got his 9 month old half sister and she along with the long line pulled him back on track as had excellent recall.

I personally would not say stop training, i think you need to ensure that you reinforce your existing training to make sure you set them up to succeed, being careful where you let them off lead or using a long line so that they can gently be pulled back into reinforce what recall means etc. I think if he is really struggling with taking any more training on then maybe you should focus on really bedding in the basics before moving on. I dont think it is an age thing the not listening so much as he is finding out that he can get away with not listening and there is stuff much more exciting. We have heavily ball focussed dogs, and they have learnt that fun comes from us, whether it is finding, retrieving or being allowed to run with it, this has stopped them straying far and chasing wildlife. It took a while to get this into the younger pup and persistance but it has paid off.

Make the training fun, rewarding and short bursts frequently and be sure she is solid on it without distractions etc before changing distraction level, dogs often do not generalise well, so whilst a sit/stay in your house may be solid, you may have to retrain this in the house with distractions, then the garden, then the garden with distractions, then the park with no distractions, then increase the level/type of distractions etc before the dog is solid.

[baguio]

There is perhaps something in the age thing. It may well happen but not always. However, without being funny I don't think you will notice with your dog as he hasn't been taught much anyway yet. I don't stop training though, ever! It can just become more challenging for a few months, that's all.

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Just a quick note - thanks for the advice - tips.

I've gone back to basics and already noticing an improvement, fairly chuffed so far