I mean that you can apply "nurture" as much as you like but if the pup doesn't have it in it's nature to work hard and fast then nurture won't help very much. You often can nurture a pup with little inborn desire into becoming a passable gundog but it will never become a truly great one.
I can drive a car but I'd never make a racing driver , I'm not and never have been good enough or keen enough to drive to the limits.
Wullie
FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
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trekmoor
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Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
If at first you don't succeed .....find out if there is a booby prize !
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Don't do what doesn't work - do what does.
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Don't do what doesn't work - do what does.
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arwesa
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Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
but if you only want a mini then why go looking at a porche? ....buy the dog to suit what you want to do with it surely? the OP was asking if FTCH and FTW parents was important...and its not if you're not looking for that level of dog and can be sure the dogs you do consider are at the level you want...
http://www.facebook.com/arwesa
As a handler, its impossible to make your dog perform better than it is, but very easy to make it perform far worse.
As a handler, its impossible to make your dog perform better than it is, but very easy to make it perform far worse.
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Hepe
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Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
Well, the problem is that a lot of those gundog minis are like porches without a steering wheel. Lots of them got plenty ability and power under the hood but the steering ability is lacking. Myself i always go for FTCH X FTCH if possible, preferably with good lines showing that it's not just a 'one hit wonder' or due to an extremely good trainer. The plodder thing might be something to consider too but if you choose from hard working hunting dogs i don't think that's too much of a worry. If you turn to lines with show in them that might be another story but even then my experience is almost the same, lack of steering wheel.arwesa wrote:but if you only want a mini then why go looking at a porche? ....buy the dog to suit what you want to do with it surely? the OP was asking if FTCH and FTW parents was important...and its not if you're not looking for that level of dog and can be sure the dogs you do consider are at the level you want...
Trainability and biddable dogs is a must if you got a Porsche engine. I'm not a breeder but if i was i would aim for easily trained early maturing dogs which i could sell to new beginners without worrying i did them a disservice. Same dog for rough shooting, beating, picking up as for trials, just the level of training and the ability of the handler making a difference. That is my vision of good gun dogs and good breeding.
The best i can get - because I'm worth it!!
Helene
Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
My thought on buying from successful stock is that what you are getting is the potential for a dog that has a proven parental history of trainability. Is that a word? My spell checker doesn't like it! :P Trainabilty, bidabilty, call it what you want its potential you are buying when you are buying a pup. What you do with it once its home is your fault! 
For me, I want to buy the most potential possible. So whilst I haven't always bought from FTCH stock (I have one that is) I buy from health tested stock with a proven track record of working.
For me, I want to buy the most potential possible. So whilst I haven't always bought from FTCH stock (I have one that is) I buy from health tested stock with a proven track record of working.-
Hepe
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Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
My spell check didn't like it either but i used it anyhow cos it says what it is about!Feebarn wrote:My thought on buying from successful stock is that what you are getting is the potential for a dog that has a proven parental history of trainability. Is that a word? My spell checker doesn't like it! :P Trainabilty, bidabilty, call it what you want its potential you are buying when you are buying a pup. What you do with it once its home is your fault!
Helene
Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
FTCH dam everytime, not so bothered about the sire as i beleive the quality comes from the bitchline. If there are FTCH's all along the bottom line all the better.
Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
Long waiting list but I agreeBIKRS wrote:FTCH dam everytime, not so bothered about the sire as i beleive the quality comes from the bitchline. If there are FTCH's all along the bottom line all the better.
BILL
Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
Long waiting list but I agreeBIKRS wrote:FTCH dam everytime, not so bothered about the sire as i beleive the quality comes from the bitchline. If there are FTCH's all along the bottom line all the better.
BILL
Re: FTCH parents? Does that really matter?
It takes two to Tango!..and it def requires two to make the Tango look good!
I was always guide by my Grandfather that 60% comes from the Bitch, so I agree with the previous few posts!..however ,He', also said you cant breed Elephants from Pygmies
There is also (i think may have been mentioned?) that a handler can have ''too much dog''!
that aint the dogs fault,or the breeder!
Just the ability of who 'has it'(imo)
I was always guide by my Grandfather that 60% comes from the Bitch, so I agree with the previous few posts!..however ,He', also said you cant breed Elephants from Pygmies
There is also (i think may have been mentioned?) that a handler can have ''too much dog''!
that aint the dogs fault,or the breeder!Just the ability of who 'has it'(imo)