Training setter to Drop

[Springfield Pointers]

If the dog is hunting at that distance, it should already be stopping to bumps without the whistle.

I did say young dogs.

Well how would a different whistle alter the root of the issue? The problem, I'd guess, is not which whistle to select...

[allan450]

well for starters they might be able to hear it.

[Springfield Pointers]

well for starters they might be able to hear it.

Shouldn't battle to hear it. But it's better to train the dog to drop to flushes or bumps.

[allan450]

So your telling me once a dog is trained to drop to flush or bumps it will always drop regardless.You must have some dogs.id rather have a loud stop whistle a dog can hear in case temptation gets to much rather then watch him chase a covey of grouse.

[Naj]

I'm not interested in trialling but I never stop a dog when it is hunting. If mine bumps or moves a bird/hare at any distance I expect her to ignore it and continue with her hunting. I can't see the point of making them sit, it's just wasting time and the bird/hare has already gone so it's no longer of interest to me or the dog. If she bumps stuff she'll maybe give it a glance or might follow on a few steps but she quickly breaks off and continues with her cast without any prompting from me. Stuff already on the move she'll not break her stride on. She certainly has no interest in chasing because she knows that finding and pointing stuff is what works. But I don't rely on the stop whistle for teaching or maintaining steadiness.

Naj

[Springfield Pointers]

So your telling me once a dog is trained to drop to flush or bumps it will always drop regardless.You must have some dogs.id rather have a loud stop whistle a dog can hear in case temptation gets to much rather then watch him chase a covey of grouse.

I probably used the wrong word in my reply. I prefer stop, as opposed to drop. But you're missing the point.

Firstly, if a dog is going to chase a covey, and assuming it's 300-400 yards from you, the chances that it's going to heed your request to stop (or drop) is questionable. So it has little to do with the fact that it hears the whistle or not.

Secondly, and to Naj's point, the reason I like a dog to stop in a hunting situation, is that it demonstrates caution. Since we're talking about pointing breeds, generally speaking - on downwind bumps - if a dog wrong-winds a bird, and keeps charging with no acknowledgment (or chasing), the chance that it's going to disturb the rest of a covey, or other game, is high. So I like a dog to show caution and stop - even briefly, before moving on with caution. And that doesn't include taking a line Certainly, I like to see that a dog acknowledges birds, it shows me the dog has its head in the game and it's not self hunting. I like dogs to be cautious in the presence of game - but not cautious to the point of being sticky.

The whistle is greatly overused in the field and like you, I also don't rely on it much in the field.

[trekmoor]

I'm with Spring pointer on this one and for much the same reasons. I also think that a 'belt and braces' approach to a bump is a very good idea. A well trained dog should stop if it flushes birds either by having received a command to do the flush or because the dog has bumped the bird or birds and the dog should do this at any distance. The stop whistle should then be unnecessary...... but it is good thing to have as a back up command........ just in case !

Wullie

[Judy]

The issue appears to be whether the dog can hear a 210.5 whistle at a distance, I've not had a problem with my dogs at 200 yards buts its very rare I've had to test that one.
I have met pickers up who never bother to teach the stop whistle but to me its pretty essential - my young dog was searching an area for a pricked partridge last season, it took off flying straight towards the road with her in hot pursuit, stop whistle proved itself then.

[allan450]

I'm not interested in trialling but I never stop a dog when it is hunting. If mine bumps or moves a bird/hare at any distance I expect her to ignore it and continue with her hunting. I can't see the point of making them sit, it's just wasting time and the bird/hare has already gone so it's no longer of interest to me or the dog. If she bumps stuff she'll maybe give it a glance or might follow on a few steps but she quickly breaks off and continues with her cast without any prompting from me. Stuff already on the move she'll not break her stride on. She certainly has no interest in chasing because she knows that finding and pointing stuff is what works. But I don't rely on the stop whistle for teaching or maintaining steadiness.

Naj

Yes naj i totally agree with the above my dogs i rough shoot over are exactly as you describe above.That all comes with experience.The only time they hear the whistle is for a recall thats it.

[allan450]

The issue appears to be whether the dog can hear a 210.5 whistle at a distance, I've not had a problem with my dogs at 200 yards buts its very rare I've had to test that one.
I have met pickers up who never bother to teach the stop whistle but to me its pretty essential - my young dog was searching an area for a pricked partridge last season, it took off flying straight towards the road with her in hot pursuit, stop whistle proved itself then.

The original poster is from ireland.I was simply stating the referee whistle is the best choice him.Dogs really have to work here to find game.On a windy day here 90 percent of the time it is when a dog is pulling out 300/400 yards he cant hear it.Its different in Scotland where is dog is getting finds every 3 or 4 casts then you wouldnt rely on the stop as much.Also if the dog is taking to much ground in front of you stop him pull him back and recast him to your left or right.Il keep doing it this way. my mate has made countless ftch with this method.